Some US Troops Still Have Grease Guns?
03 Dec 2008
M3 'Grease Gun'
Quite a while back, a reader sent Murdoc this link: 2nd ID soldiers converting to M-4 rifles
They’re talking about the division’s 1st Brigade, deployed in South Korea. The other three maneuver brigades of the 2nd ID are Stryker brigades and already equipped with the M4. It’s a little unclear about how many troops in the 1st Brigade are turning in their M16s for M4s. The switch to the M4 has been pretty much Army-wide.
This is what caught my attention:
Throughout the Army, the M-4 is replacing the M-16, the M-3 submachine gun and the M-9 pistol in select cases for unit leaders, crew-served gunners, vehicle crews, radio operators, infantry and combat engineers, a PEO Soldier spokeswoman said. [emphasis Murdoc's]
Does anyone really still have M3 SMGs? I think I remember reading that some support types still had them in the 91 Gulf War, but I guess I would have thought the few remaining would have been totally phased out during the gutting of the military in the 90s.
If they’re still used, are they chambered for .45? Or have they converted to 9mm?
December 3rd, 2008 at 10:51 am
I was told by a retired Sgt. Major out of Levenworth that all M1 Abrams crew were issued a M-3 greasegun but that was in the early ’90’s. I did hear that they still were till recenly. Wasn’t well liked but was the only personal weapon issued besides whatever pistol was issued.
Hard to believe
December 3rd, 2008 at 11:06 am
I suspect the PEO-Soldier media person was just reading from the same old boilerplate script written up in the early ’90s.
The article also repeats my pet peeve about putting dashes in the weapon designations. US military small arms designations DO NOT have dashes. This was hashed out many times decades ago in “The American Rifleman”, back when their technical staff was largely populated by ex-Ordnance Corps veterans.
December 3rd, 2008 at 11:21 am
We had Grease Guns in our National Guard Armory about 4 years ago. They were issued to tank crews. I always wanted some trigger time with one.
December 3rd, 2008 at 12:13 pm
I was just thinking…strictly speaking myself or other staff types weren’t “vehicle crew”, but we spent an awful lot of time driving and maintaining (and cursing) ‘577s.
We weren’t issued M3s but the mechanics were, who again were not by MOS “vehicle crew” but DID man the VTR and M88.
Not that I was jealous- looked like a piece of crap to me.
December 3rd, 2008 at 3:33 pm
My last Look at the M-3 was too far back (1977) to be of relevance, but for “GeekLethal”, the M3A1 might have looked like a cheap piece of crap, and indeed, it WAS cheap. Mine were produced by GM’s “Guide Lamp” division at a cost of around twenty bucks a copy.
However,it was one heck of a gun. It did 450 rounds per minute of .45 ACP, not a slouchy cartridge by any standard, and a good operator could squeeze of single shots easily. Hundred yard shots on a man-sized silhouette were a ‘gimme’ if you actually extended the retractable stock and used the sights.
MC
old tanker
December 3rd, 2008 at 5:52 pm
In 1987 I was trained on the M3A1 during tank school just in case we got sent to a tank battalion that still had the M60’s.
In 1988 when I was posted to A-3-34 AR, they had M1(IP) Abrams and no M3A1s. The Cav troop across the way still had M60A3s and the grease guns. As far I was able to find out, the M3A1s went away when a unit transitioned to the M1.
December 3rd, 2008 at 9:37 pm
I had M3s in arms rooms as late as 1998, but only for M88 crews (the tankers had their “crew served” M16s, or shortly after M4s). There aren’t any more in active duty army units, though it is possible there are still some in the Guard somewhere.
It could also be that the PEO rep was just quoting from the original M4 requirement, which was to replace the M3s among other things.
December 4th, 2008 at 12:48 am
[...] uncovered a story which mentions that the US Army still has the WWII era M3 “grease gun” [...]
December 4th, 2008 at 1:33 pm
When I was stationed with the 4th ID from 90-94, we still used them. They were issued to some tank crews as well as support mechanics. We had several that I had to maintain in the arms room.
December 4th, 2008 at 8:33 pm
M3s are a Basic Issue Item (BII) for the M-88 armored recovery vehicle. If 2ID has those, then they would be the ones being replaced.
December 4th, 2008 at 8:51 pm
We got a batch of brand new in box General Motors Guide Lamp Division M3A1’s in at my reserve unit in the early 90’s for our M88 Recovery Vehicle crews. They were Korean War vintage manufacture but still brand spanking new in sealed boxes.
December 4th, 2008 at 9:01 pm
Oh yeah, they were still chambered in .45ACP. At that point in time we’d just swapped out the last of our 1911’s but the M3A1’s were still .45ACP as originally manufactured.
December 4th, 2008 at 9:51 pm
The M-4 is fine for amateur shooters and rear echelon types with plenty of time to clean them. They suck if you’re in combat trying to shoot insurgents in a sandy environment through windows, car doors and other barriers. They should be replacing the M-3’s with a good gas piston rifle instead.
December 4th, 2008 at 11:18 pm
That’s still an F’n awesome close range weapon. Anyone who has ever used one (or even just heard one) will certainly agree. It’s like 80% of a MAC10 for 10% of the cost. Or maybe 1000% of a 1911 for twice the cost.
As long as they can get them the ammo (you know I’m a logistics freak) I don’t see a problem with equipping certain troops with grease guns.
Pineapple grenades still work great too.
March 4th, 2009 at 11:59 pm
I served from ‘04-’08, including in Iraq and I never saw a grease gun. For that matter, the only troops I saw with 1911’s were Marine Recon. Most troops are either issued an M16 or an M4, and may additionally carry an M9. The ground-pounders have some SAW’S and 203’s mixed in (I’ve even seen a female soldier carrying a SAW–kinda odd). That’s about it.
Then again, you can still find deuce-and-a-half trucks (also 1940’s vintage) rumbling around many bases. So it’s feasible.