Comments on: Civil War Saturday: Bayonets http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/6712.html Just another WordPress weblog Mon, 22 Mar 2010 02:24:34 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9 hourly 1 By: Kristopher http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/6712.html/comment-page-1#comment-339790 Kristopher Mon, 01 Dec 2008 18:36:45 +0000 http://www.murdoconline.net/?p=6712#comment-339790 Civil war era bayonet training was still hit or miss. Units got bayonet training only if their commanders thought it was important. Nationalized state militia units often had none at all. Newly formed Black units usually got fully trained, since it was in the drill manual. Yes there were exceptions, but this was still usually the case. There were exceptions to the thin as a rail Johnny-Rebb rule too ( and these always get trotted out when an overweight re-enactor wants to do a confederate impression ... heh ), but the stereotype was still valid. Civil war era bayonet training was still hit or miss.

Units got bayonet training only if their commanders thought it was important. Nationalized state militia units often had none at all. Newly formed Black units usually got fully trained, since it was in the drill manual.

Yes there were exceptions, but this was still usually the case. There were exceptions to the thin as a rail Johnny-Rebb rule too ( and these always get trotted out when an overweight re-enactor wants to do a confederate impression … heh ), but the stereotype was still valid.

]]> By: Bram http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/6712.html/comment-page-1#comment-339759 Bram Mon, 01 Dec 2008 12:27:10 +0000 http://www.murdoconline.net/?p=6712#comment-339759 Marines still spend a lot of time training with the bayonet. Even our current diminutive bayonets can make a horrendous wound when the 5 Killing Blows are properly applied. I can imagine infantry Marines deciding to clear houses with the blade – I can also imagine them succeeding and freaking out the insurgents in the process. Marines still spend a lot of time training with the bayonet. Even our current diminutive bayonets can make a horrendous wound when the 5 Killing Blows are properly applied. I can imagine infantry Marines deciding to clear houses with the blade – I can also imagine them succeeding and freaking out the insurgents in the process.

]]> By: Phelps http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/6712.html/comment-page-1#comment-339682 Phelps Sun, 30 Nov 2008 19:06:38 +0000 http://www.murdoconline.net/?p=6712#comment-339682 I was going to make the same point General Patton already made more succinctly. I would add that the men fixing them are encouraged and motivated by the action, and there is no mistake in your intentions when it is affixed. Didn't I read somewhere that in the early days of OIF than the Marines had to issue a quiet reminder that bayonet charges are not part of the house clearing doctrine after they briefly came into fashion? I was going to make the same point General Patton already made more succinctly. I would add that the men fixing them are encouraged and motivated by the action, and there is no mistake in your intentions when it is affixed.

Didn’t I read somewhere that in the early days of OIF than the Marines had to issue a quiet reminder that bayonet charges are not part of the house clearing doctrine after they briefly came into fashion?

]]> By: J.M. Heinrichs http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/6712.html/comment-page-1#comment-339615 J.M. Heinrichs Sun, 30 Nov 2008 05:37:20 +0000 http://www.murdoconline.net/?p=6712#comment-339615 "... as British troops swarmed the mountaintop and drove the Argentines out, at times fighting with fixed bayonets. Major Kiszely, ... , was the first man into the enemy position, personally shooting two enemy conscripts and bayoneting a third, his bayonet breaking in two." (14 Jun 82) Also: "He said: "I decided the best way to attack was a full-frontal assault. It was my decision to fix bayonets."" http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1299447/posts Bayonets are still quite useful. Cheers “… as British troops swarmed the mountaintop and drove the Argentines out, at times fighting with fixed bayonets. Major Kiszely, … , was the first man into the enemy position, personally shooting two enemy conscripts and bayoneting a third, his bayonet breaking in two.” (14 Jun 82)

Also: “He said: “I decided the best way to attack was a full-frontal assault. It was my decision to fix bayonets.”" http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1299447/posts

Bayonets are still quite useful.

Cheers

]]> By: Grey http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/6712.html/comment-page-1#comment-339614 Grey Sun, 30 Nov 2008 05:18:17 +0000 http://www.murdoconline.net/?p=6712#comment-339614 "Few men are killed by the bayonet, many are scared by it. Bayonets should be fixed when the fire fight starts" - General George Patton Jr, "War as I knew it" 1947 I can see them getting some nasty use in the era of muzzle loaders. Spears had been amung the king of weapons for a long time until firearms came along, so it just seems a natural evolution. Nowadays, it would seem like Bayonets are merely something thats just meant to frighten until you really need one, in which case you "really" need one. Being ex AF though, I'll leave that one as merely conjecture. Hah! “Few men are killed by the bayonet, many are scared by it. Bayonets should be fixed when the fire fight starts”
- General George Patton Jr, “War as I knew it” 1947

I can see them getting some nasty use in the era of muzzle loaders. Spears had been amung the king of weapons for a long time until firearms came along, so it just seems a natural evolution.

Nowadays, it would seem like Bayonets are merely something thats just meant to frighten until you really need one, in which case you “really” need one. Being ex AF though, I’ll leave that one as merely conjecture. Hah!

]]> By: Firehand http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/6712.html/comment-page-1#comment-339592 Firehand Sun, 30 Nov 2008 01:31:23 +0000 http://www.murdoconline.net/?p=6712#comment-339592 I read somewhere, years ago, an account by a doctor from either the Brit or American army(I DID say it was years ago) saying that he rarely saw a bayonet wound; that when it came to bayonet-point the unit that either had less discipline or who'd been worse injured in the volleys would retreat or break and run(depending on remaining discipline). Those who didn't... well, you made the point about only treating wounded who were alive and might remain so. I read somewhere, years ago, an account by a doctor from either the Brit or American army(I DID say it was years ago) saying that he rarely saw a bayonet wound; that when it came to bayonet-point the unit that either had less discipline or who’d been worse injured in the volleys would retreat or break and run(depending on remaining discipline). Those who didn’t… well, you made the point about only treating wounded who were alive and might remain so.

]]> By: GunPundit » Blog Archive » Bayonets http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/6712.html/comment-page-1#comment-339560 GunPundit » Blog Archive » Bayonets Sat, 29 Nov 2008 17:05:53 +0000 http://www.murdoconline.net/?p=6712#comment-339560 [...] week’s entry, the third, is about Bayonets. Go check it out and add to the discussion in the comments section if [...] [...] week’s entry, the third, is about Bayonets. Go check it out and add to the discussion in the comments section if [...]

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